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Thread: Joan Crawford

  1. #751
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    I think JC was batshit crazy - don't make ya a bad person.

    I would think it was all BS, but I have read where other "Stars" had seen the way she treated CC. She was all about Joan and what could keep her name on the marquee...
    My Posse's On Broadway

  2. #752
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    Christina wrote Mommy Dearest after Joan died, when the will was read and she found out that Joan didn't leave her or Chris any money. Good video editing, never watched StraightJacket will have to watch it now.
    No More Stolen Sisters.

  3. #753
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    Thanks, @pkstracy! The film is pretty good and pretty campy.

  4. #754
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    I can't remember which biography I read it from but Joan Crawford said to her agent upon leaving the theater where "Strait Jacket" premiered "I think I gave the best performance of my life."

  5. #755
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    One of my favorites as is Valley Of The Dolls, classic camp ! I love the extras on Strait Jacket, Joan's costume and hair and makeup tests.. just as good as the movie !
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  6. #756
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mansfield67 View Post
    One of my favorites as is Valley Of The Dolls, classic camp ! I love the extras on Strait Jacket, Joan's costume and hair and makeup tests.. just as good as the movie !
    Valley of the Dolls had the greatest of the 60's designers, William Travilla. So many gorgeous dresses. The "cage" dress that Neely wears to the Grammy Awards cost $1,500 to make. And so many think that the costumes Susan Hayward wore were the same ones Judy Garland tested in and obviously they weren't. I loved that red cordoroy suit Judy wore in the dressing room scene. It is obvious the fabric and the colour of that suit was different from the one Hayward wore.

    Both films are in my "queer" collection, along with Whatever Happened to Baby Jane (my fave) and Mommie Dearest. I went to a Halloween Ball at the Masonic Temple as Judy Garland from ICGOS and met a man that had Jane's costume when she goes to place her ad down to a tee. It was extraordinary - right down to the rhinestone pin in the hair.
    Last edited by KissingJosh; 07-20-2015 at 10:42 AM.

  7. #757
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    You're welcome, I have the book Bette and Joan the feud or something like that, sitting near me, I haven't started it yet, been reading Bitter Blood at the moment.
    No More Stolen Sisters.

  8. #758
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    Travilla was brilliant, especially on VOD. The clothes are gorgeous, I love what Sharon is wearing when watching the Gillian Girl commercial. Dolly Read wore it in Beyond The Valley Of The Dolls (another staple in my collection) but it doesn't have the same impact ! I had really, really long hair in the early 70's, and I was always doing it up like Barbara's in the commercial. I went to a club called Mama Coopers like that one night and everyone knew right away. LOL. God, I wish I had pictures ! Looks like we have the same taste in movies, I love Baby Jane, have you heard the song Baby Jane by Lunchbox ? Fun for dancing and saying the lines !
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    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  9. #759
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    Wow - how many hairpieces did you need? In the early 70's I was still a child and it was one night when I couldn't sleep that I went downstairs and my mom was watching VOTD on TV - right at the beginning of "I'll Plant My Own Tree" and I was mesmerized! She let me watch the rest of the movie even though I had to get up for school the next morning. In my youthful innocence I thought wow - Susan Hayward must have had ALOT of hair to also wear a bun on top and a ponytail in back AND diamonds in the hair! I didn't remember much of the rest of the movie except that song and how I wanted to belt it out just like her.

    I like what Jackie Susanne said about Joan Crawford thinking Helen Lawson was based on her - "Ethel Merman is a lady and a philanthropist compared to Joan Crawford. If I created a character like her, Helen Lawson would have been a monster."

  10. #760
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    Bless your mother for letting you stay up to watch it ! Actually my hair at the time was almost waist length, so a friend was able to do it up almost the same ! God, I loved those days, shrink t-shirts, skin tight leather pants and leopard platforms.. and Anne Welles hair ! I'm checking with friends to see if any photos were taken during that period. I'm hoping ! I was 12 when I bought the paperback edition of VOD for 65 cents ! There was a painting of Jackie on the back in this fab gown and she had a matching jacket slung over her shoulder, and I thought I have to have this ! When the film played in town there was a restricted label on the poster, so there was no way I could get in to see it. I was green with envy watching people buy their tickets. Then it played on TV, I guess in 1971, my best friend and I thought we had died and gone to heaven ! That's when we started doing the hair ! When the DVD edition came out with all the extras, we watched it together and thought it doesn't get any better then this ! I still have my VHS version, as well as the soundtrack on record and CD, plus a really weather beaten paperback and a later one that came out a few years ago. I would love to get a first edition hardback. I also have an MP3 of The Arbours doing the theme, that Jackie is said to have written and wanted used in the film. Oh yes, and I have Patty Duke Sings Songs From The Valley Of The Dolls.... painfully off key ! I think a couple might still be up on YouTube. A friend found this photo ( everyone is on high alert now!) and was able to scan it for me, this is 1970 and I was 15. My hair was cut in layers then so most of it is to one side and down the back, by the following year it was maybe 5 in. longer. By '73 I cut it all off and adopted a 1940's look in clothes because I wanted to look like Zachary Scott in Mildred Pierce... which brings it all back to Joan Crawford ! That is so weird !
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    Last edited by Mansfield67; 07-22-2015 at 12:10 AM.
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  11. #761
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mansfield67 View Post
    Bless your mother for letting you stay up to watch it ! Actually my hair at the time was almost waist length, so a friend was able to do it up almost the same ! God, I loved those days, shrink t-shirts, skin tight leather pants and leopard platforms.. and Anne Welles hair ! I'm checking with friends to see if any photos were taken during that period. I'm hoping ! I was 12 when I bought the paperback edition of VOD for 65 cents ! There was a painting of Jackie on the back in this fab gown and she had a matching jacket slung over her shoulder, and I thought I have to have this ! When the film played in town there was a restricted label on the poster, so there was no way I could get in to see it. I was green with envy watching people buy their tickets. Then it played on TV, I guess in 1971, my best friend and I thought we had died and gone to heaven ! That's when we started doing the hair ! When the DVD edition came out with all the extras, we watched it together and thought it doesn't get any better then this ! I still have my VHS version, as well as the soundtrack on record and CD, plus a really weather beaten paperback and a later one that came out a few years ago. I would love to get a first edition hardback. I also have an MP3 of The Arbours doing the theme, that Jackie is said to have written and wanted used in the film. Oh yes, and I have Patty Duke Sings Songs From The Valley Of The Dolls.... painfully off key ! I think a couple might still be up on YouTube. A friend found this photo ( everyone is on high alert now!) and was able to scan it for me, this is 1970 and I was 15. My hair was cut in layers then so most of it is to one side and down the back, by the following year it was maybe 5 in. longer. By '73 I cut it all off and adopted a 1940's look in clothes because I wanted to look like Zachary Scott in Mildred Pierce... which brings it all back to Joan Crawford ! That is so weird !
    I think in your photo you look like a pre-uberplastic surgery Pete Burns.
    Last edited by KissingJosh; 07-22-2015 at 07:16 AM.

  12. #762
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    Is that a good thing ? LOL
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  13. #763
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    He was the frontman for "Dead or Alive". Google him. He was going for a "look" in the 80's and took a que from Boy George. Now he's totally unrecognizable. Do you have TCM? It's Joan Crawford day on August 10 which culminates with Trog - at 4:45 a.m. - and she probably would have agreed that would be the best time to air it.

  14. #764
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    Quote Originally Posted by KissingJosh View Post
    I think in your photo you look like a pre-uberplastic surgery Pete Burns.
    That is EXACTLY what I thought!!! I'm a huge Pete Burns fan, but the way he messed up his face broke my heart.
    To understand the living, you got to commune with the dead.
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  15. #765
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    I have Dead Or Alive Evolution:The Videos on DVD. I noticed he was up to something facially when they did Your Sweetness Is Your Weakness. I always thought he was rather attractive, and when they did a remix of You Spin Me Round I thought WTF! Sad really, once you start messing with your face there is no turning back. No one had ever said you look like Pete Burns, most people thought I resembled Anthony Perkins... Psycho.. Thanks ! LOL I don't have TCM, but I have a lot on DVD, she should have gotten her first Oscar nom for A Woman's Face. I love her in that. P.S. I wonder if I could sue Pete for copying my look ! LOL
    Last edited by Mansfield67; 07-23-2015 at 05:08 PM.
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  16. #766
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    Mansfield, apparently the vid is not available to view in America. I've followed Pete's career and know what you mean. He was incredible to look at before the mess. I watched an entire season of Celebrity Big Brother UK on YouTube just because he was on it. He's not one bit sorry for about the plastic surgery (according to him) and likes the way he looks. Sorry for being off topic mods. I'll stop now.
    To understand the living, you got to commune with the dead.
    Minerva

  17. #767
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    Someone should start a thread on Pete actually. Do you mean the DVD ? A friend got it for me, it's all regions so it says. It will play on my computer and a cheap DVD player I had to buy to view it. Go figure. Off topic mods... sorry Joan !
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    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  18. #768
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    I LOVED "A Woman's Face." Cukor could always push the right buttons - especially when she was slapping the shit out of Osa Massen. I thought she was wonderful. Then she somehow got it into her head that by e-nun-ci-a-ting every word it made her a better actress when it really made her rather wooden. She was nowhere as good in "Mildred Pierce" as she was in "A Woman's Face" or "Humoresque". She was wonderful in "Sudden Fear" too but I think she went overboard in 47's Possessed despite the Oscar nomination.

    You could have done worse with a Pete Burns monniker. I was told by many that I look like George Michael. And apparently he had his face tweaked too.

  19. #769
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    No. No! It was a great post. I'm sure I speak for many others when I say we appreciate all the hard work you put into that. Total RESPECT, & good job!!

  20. #770
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    I agree with you, she was good in MP, but gave a beautifully shaded performance in AWF. Cukor didn't get the moniker "a woman's director" for nothing. I love Joan in The Women also, everyone is good in that..the exception being Norma Shearer who probably wasn't listening to his direction ! Too many big gestures, and facial expressions. I suppose she couldn't shake those from her silent picture days. I read a bio on her, her last years were very sad. I found this Oscar winners for the 25th anniversary, Joan is at 2:24... now these were movie stars !
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  21. #771
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    We're approaching the 40th Deathiversary of Joan's passing, and I'm still reeling from binge-watching Feud while transferring it to DVD, lol. How appropriate of them to play the Doors' "The End" during the Trog montage. As dreadful as some people may find Joan's last film, have they ever seen Ray Milland in "The Thing With Two Heads" ??

  22. #772
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    Joan just couldn't let go. The most egregious act in her later years was when her daughter Christina was sick, replacing her in a soap opera. I don't know how close Feud stuck to the facts, but I'll bet it wasn't far off the mark. When I was a kid she scared me a little, something about that mad or needy stare, but in her precode movies (which I saw much later) the effect was less and I got to see what might have evolved had she been able to defeat her childhood demons. Bette was also flawed, of course, but much less so. Shame her daughter held a grudge against her even after her stroke, which caused her ex husband Gary Merrill to appear on television, defend his ex and deplore his stepdaughter's criticisms.

  23. #773
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    Ughhhhhh.... I am having "Feud" withdrawal's something fierce....
    My Posse's On Broadway

  24. #774
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    Loved Feud, can't wait for the DVD to come out !
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  25. #775
    I managed to stumble on a youtube video which led me to a facebook group not long ago after watching an interview with Christina.

    "Christina Crawford Lied" is the name. Obviously not an objective bunch, but what they (the admin) allege to have made my jaw drop.

    Christina Crawford claimed in her book "Mommie Dearest" that Joan Crawford strangled her in June 1953, and that she was saved by Joan's secretary, who pulled Joan off of her. The secretary's name was not revealed in the original 1978 edition of "Mommie Dearest." The publisher, William Morrow, suspiciously omitted it. However, Christina reveals the secretary's name as "Billie" in the anniversary editions of her book. The secretary's name was Billie Greene.

    For the first time ever the public will read what the EYE WITNESS to this event says happened that evening in an unpublished interview with Greene. In the interview, Greene adamantly DENIES the allegation that Joan strangled Christina.

    Additionally, it will be made public for the first time ever that Christina LIED, under oath, regarding the "strangling" accusation. In an uncovered 1978 sworn deposition Christina Crawford REPEATEDLY DENIED any knowledge of the strangling incident. When asked about this incident in the sworn deposition, Christina responded: "I do not know what you are referring to."
    This sworn deposition was conducted simultaneously to Christina writing and publishing "Mommie Dearest."

    The "strangling" incident was the most violent and extreme allegation Christina Crawford made against Joan Crawford. The eye witness denied it, and Christina denied it when she was questioned under oath.


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  26. #776
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    I have never believed Christina. She was jealous of Joan's fame, she wrote that book out of spite. I think Joan saw her as ungrateful hence the reason she cut her off. Christina would never be what she wanted to be, a star like Joan Crawford.
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  27. #777
    I saw the movie and read the book when I was around 10 or 11. I did a re-read of it out of curiosity and it is effective and not altogether unbelievable. I always thought she wrote it out of spite, but it was due to this all happening, reconciling later on in life, then being cut out of The Will in such a nasty, public way in some bizarre rage over something minor known only to Joan.

    If this person has what they say they do, they need to quit teasing it and show the documents. It would all be there in black and white and expose Christina’s lies. I was so repulsed when I saw this and what it meant if it was true. If the admin is who I think they are, I believe it. This should’ve come out years and years ago.

    After this bombshell, I realized that beyond “Baby Jane” (honestly Bette Davis owned that movie; I wouldn’t consider it a Joan Crawford movie) I had never watched a Joan Crawford movie. I had believed Mommie Dearest and I couldn’t sit through one of her movies.

    So, I decided to watch Mildred Pierce. I really have been missing out. The movie was damn good, and I’m not sure how stiff the competition was, but Joan deserved that Oscar. I can’t imagine anyone else being better that year in her category.

    I also had never realized how beautiful she was until I watched that.

    Any recommendations? On hand I have Sudden Fear, Humoresque and Queen Bee.

  28. #778
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    I am sure Joan could be tough like any parent, but not all that abuse Christina claims. But that's what made it sell. I think she made it all up including the reason Joan cut her from the will. Most people claimed she was an arrogant devious brat who expected to be treated like her mother. There had to be resentment on her part when she quite never made it, say like Jane Fonda. I saw her on a show a few years ago, still bitter about it all.
    As for Joan films, A Woman's Face, The Damned Don't Cry and Flamingo Road are just a few of my favorites. Her performance on Night Gallery should have gotten her an Emmy nomination. Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Night_Gallery_Eyes-995850827-large.jpg 
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ID:	55174 Here is a clip of Joan doing a send up of her screen persona ! And a clever montage of her films, they used to play this in the clubs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzjeqEEarGw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=645oT8fsxT8
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  29. #779
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mansfield67 View Post
    I am sure Joan could be tough like any parent, but not all that abuse Christina claims. But that's what made it sell. I think she made it all up including the reason Joan cut her from the will. Most people claimed she was an arrogant devious brat who expected to be treated like her mother. There had to be resentment on her part when she quite never made it, say like Jane Fonda. I saw her on a show a few years ago, still bitter about it all.
    As for Joan films, A Woman's Face, The Damned Don't Cry and Flamingo Road are just a few of my favorites. Her performance on Night Gallery should have gotten her an Emmy nomination. Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Night_Gallery_Eyes-995850827-large.jpg 
Views:	26 
Size:	78.5 KB 
ID:	55174 Here is a clip of Joan doing a send up of her screen persona ! And a clever montage of her films, they used to play this in the clubs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzjeqEEarGw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=645oT8fsxT8
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  30. #780
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    She was totally believable in that role.
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  31. #781
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mansfield67 View Post
    I am sure Joan could be tough like any parent, but not all that abuse Christina claims. But that's what made it sell. I think she made it all up including the reason Joan cut her from the will. Most people claimed she was an arrogant devious brat who expected to be treated like her mother. There had to be resentment on her part when she quite never made it, say like Jane Fonda. I saw her on a show a few years ago, still bitter about it all.
    As for Joan films, A Woman's Face, The Damned Don't Cry and Flamingo Road are just a few of my favorites. Her performance on Night Gallery should have gotten her an Emmy nomination. Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Night_Gallery_Eyes-995850827-large.jpg 
Views:	26 
Size:	78.5 KB 
ID:	55174 Here is a clip of Joan doing a send up of her screen persona ! And a clever montage of her films, they used to play this in the clubs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzjeqEEarGw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=645oT8fsxT8
    Wasn't there people who claimed they saw it though? I have seen interviews where people backed her up and Christina seems to have stuck to the same story all these years unlike BO Hyman who swaps and changes depending on the weather.
    There are only two definites in life....you are born and you die. The rest is anyone's guess.

  32. #782
    Quote Originally Posted by shellc View Post
    Wasn't there people who claimed they saw it though? I have seen interviews where people backed her up and Christina seems to have stuck to the same story all these years unlike BO Hyman who swaps and changes depending on the weather.
    They saw incidents that honestly are tame from what I’m remembering. It wasn’t abuse but because Christina has alleged abuse afterward, this tame incident now seems “bigger” than it originally was. The secretary that allegedly pulled Joan off of Christina said that incident didn’t happen at all. It is the most violent incident part of the book. If that isn’t true, what else is isn’t?

  33. #783
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    I always take people who "claim" things with a grain of salt. It's like the Tate murders with half of Hollywood claiming they had been invited to stop by that night. Just before she died Patty Duke secretly admitted she was going to stop by that night ! You waited 40+ yrs.! I think people like to get their 15 minutes whenever and however they can get it. There were a few who said they saw the abuse, but there were far more that said this never happened. Some of the biggest stars including Barbara Stanwyck, who had been friends with Joan since the late 1920's went on record to say she never saw a thing. Others included Myrna Loy and Katherine Hepburn. Joan was probably strict but not unlike a lot of parents. Director Vincent Sherman who was a long time friend said Christina must have been living in someone else's house. But years later said there was abuse. Hmm, who do believe.
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  34. #784
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    My mother abused me, and no one saw. It wasn't as bad as what Christina said Joan did to her, but it was bad enough to scar me for life. I've written about it. People who knew me my whole life have read my blog and said, "Cindy I didn't know." That's because I never talked about. I had exactly one friend who said, "Cindy, your mother is crazy." And she was. She made me do things that Daddy would have killed her for making me do but I never told him. Why? IDK. I just did not tell on one to the other. Kristina may have been telling the whole true or embellishing what actually happened, or lying out her piehole. The truth is, like Mansfield just said, we should take everything we read and hear with a grain of salt.

  35. #785
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    Getting spanked within reason, or being picked up by the scruff of your neck and taken out to the car if you were acting up in a store would appear abusive to some. I was never spanked, but the latter happened a couple of times. I remember parents yelling for their kids to "Get in the house now !" Or "Your father will deal with you when he comes home". That was pretty normal. Being told to stay in your room and not to come out until your told to, but is that a form of abuse or being threatened ? I have seen kids throw major tantrums in stores and the parents are totally oblivious. I suppose they don't want someone calling the police on them if they act to harshly and drag the kid out kicking and screaming.
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

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