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Thread: George Floyd

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimC View Post
    I'm not so sure.

    I think the physical evidence will likely support the heart attack and drug OD argument.
    It seems that there may not be any physical evidence to support any other cause.

    I personally don't think we can say that Chauvin's action contributed to the death - the medical experts and the jury will have to figure that out.
    I suspect that if the cops had gotten there 15-20 minutes later, they wouldn't have been arresting him, they would have been trying to revive him.

    Here's why they restrained him that way as I gather from some of the recently released transcripts:

    When they had him in the vehicle, he was flailing around and banging his head and face against the interior of the vehicle.
    He had lacerated his mouth and was causing himself harm.

    They removed him from the vehicle and restrained him in such a way that he could not continue injuring himself - most particularly beating his head against the pavement.
    They had called an ambulance early on in the interaction, they were trying to keep him immobilized until it arrived.

    Had they not done that, he would have been slamming his head and face against the pavement, and that would be the thing we're blaming them for today as contributing to his death - inaction rather than action.

    I suspect that the verdict will depend a lot on assessments of how closely Chauvin followed the training and accepted procedure for using that restraint.

    My personal feeling as an uneducated observer is that they acted properly and within the scope of their training; maybe the experts in the matter will contradict and disprove that.
    He was fired because he didn't follow training.

  2. #102
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  3. #103
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    He was also arrested for a murder that may not have occurred.
    It's often better to gather facts and follow them rather than acting upon perceptions or sentiments.
    A faulty hypothesis forming:
    A German scientist using Iranian physics and French mathematics.



  4. #104
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    If someone is having a heart attack and you hold them down until they die.........................

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by john*thomas View Post
    If someone is having a heart attack and you hold them down until they die.........................
    If you know someone is having a heart attack.

    But if:
    What you do know is that the person is seriously intoxicated because you see it in his behavior and he admitted to doing drugs
    What you do know is that even while handcuffed inside of a vehicle, he was thrashing around and beating his head against the interior of the vehicle
    What you do know is that if not restrained he will likely continue self-injurious behavior, now against a canvas of concrete or asphalt
    What you do know is that you called for an ambulance early on and called a second time expressing urgency

    Then you probably just try to keep him still until that ambulance arrives using an effective yet generally safe method of restraint that you have been trained to employ in situations much like the one you are in.

    Anybody who sees that video will find it appalling.

    We see the pain and anguish on Floyd's face while the cop is kneeling on him, and our first normal, human impression is that the cop is causing him that pain and anguish.
    He probably wasn't.

    We think there can't be any good reason to have three cops pinning down a man who is handcuffed.
    But maybe there was.

    We watched the man die and naturally felt that he died because of the behavior of the cop.
    He probably didn't.

    I'm right there with many who think it appears that the cops behaved improperly or with disregard for the life of the man; but I wasn't right there in their shoes knowing what they know, and the outcome of this won't likely come down to feelings, appearances or proclamations that a death by mechanical asphyxiation leaves no physical evidence.

    I don't know if the cop was wrong or criminal in his actions or not, but I'll assume not until the evidence aligns with the appearance.
    A faulty hypothesis forming:
    A German scientist using Iranian physics and French mathematics.



  6. #106
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    Many people were telling the officer there was something wrong with Floyd. Cauvin didn't care.

  7. #107
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    Defense attorneys for Chauvin have asked a judge to dismiss murder charges against him, saying that Floyd's drug use caused his death, not any improper action or use of force by the cops.

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/derek-cha...200154759.html

    I'm guessing that:

    1. The judge likely should dismiss those charges, they were levied prematurely to placate emotional, mob mentality.
    2. The charges will not be dismissed.

    My suspicion is that the family has already been prepared for either dismissal or acquittal; and that is why they have already file civil charges.
    A faulty hypothesis forming:
    A German scientist using Iranian physics and French mathematics.



  8. #108
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    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0312211312~2.jpg 
Views:	14 
Size:	112.7 KB 
ID:	55143

    I took this quickly during a breaking news story, so the quality's not the best. It's the content that's important though. $27 M approved by the Minneapolis City Council as damages to be given to the Floyd family. I'm sure there'll be online stories about it shortly. It was just on CBSN.
    .


  9. #109
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  10. #110
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    If I did something at work that led to someone getting killed and it cost the company $27 million dollars I doubt you would find many people arguing that I was just doing my job.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by john*thomas View Post
    If I did something at work that led to someone getting killed and it cost the company $27 million dollars I doubt you would find many people arguing that I was just doing my job.
    Same here. I work at a college, so no that's not how it would go.
    .


  12. #112
    Chauvin is Guilty.

  13. #113
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    Yes. He is.

  14. #114
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    Guilty on all 3 charges, it will be decades before he sees the light.
    " I always like talking to people who are older. Of course, every year it gets harder to find them. " Fran Lebowitz

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mansfield67 View Post
    Guilty on all 3 charges, it will be decades before he sees the light.
    This is good news - well, better news would have been if this was never in the news at all and Floyd had been allowed to sit up and breathe.

    It’s haunting to re-listen to the audio with the witnesses pleading for Floyd to be let up, and finally for his vitals to be checked (e.g. the one guy who called Chauvin “bro” a bazillion times). This crime would have been horrible if there were no bystanders shouting and trying to intervene. But the fact that they WERE makes it a stronger, sadder statement.

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by MirrorDimly View Post
    This is good news - well, better news would have been if this was never in the news at all and Floyd had been allowed to sit up and breathe.

    It’s haunting to re-listen to the audio with the witnesses pleading for Floyd to be let up, and finally for his vitals to be checked (e.g. the one guy who called Chauvin “bro” a bazillion times). This crime would have been horrible if there were no bystanders shouting and trying to intervene. But the fact that they WERE makes it a stronger, sadder statement.
    Sadly if it hadn't been recorded Chauvin is still a police officer.

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