John F. Kennedy

[kmgt]

What's everyone opinion on Jackie's movements right after? I always assumed she was trying to climb out of the car (I admit, I was never really into the JFK assasination. I'm only 34). Then I thought maybe she was climbing out and the SS guy told her to get down? I never even for a second thought "she's picking up his brains". But that's certainly what it looks like. Then again, she doesn't even appear to look back that way until she actually gets up to climb back there. So how would she even know there was something laying on the trunk, for sure?

[Bidmor]

Well there's the theory that she panicked after hearing all the shots and seeing her husband's head explode while she was holding him and, out of natural survival instinct, was getting out of the line of fire and heading toward the agents' car for cover.

Then there's the old one that she just lost it and was crawling out onto the trunk to retrieve pieces of her husband's skull and brain matter.

The latest theory I heard is pretty wild...that Jackie was in on the plot and was to be the one who delivered the kill shot. Supposedly she had some sort of small, one round gun in her right hand and pressed it up against the upper left side of his neck, just under his jaw bone, hesitated for a moment, then fired. At virtually the same moment, the forward shooter pulled his trigger and both rounds went through JFK's head, her round a split second before the forward shooter's round.

Fearing that she waited too late and that she was going to be next, Jackie throws something down (presumably the weapon) onto the car seat, then rather forcefully pushes JFK's body down on the car seat as she starts to climb out, before the agent gets her back in the seat.

In any event, Jackie's actions are curious after the head shot which could easily be shock and panic, or sheer instinct was telling her "he's done...get outta here...I'm next".

Taking into account how close her head was to JFK's at the time of the kill shot, there was some mighty good shooting going on that day.

[Upset]

JFK? Blown away?? What else do I have to say?!

[Mcafgr]

I think there was no way Jackie was involved....when you look at the film she is clearly retrieving something off the trunk.....as for the rest of the conspiracy theories...there is no way in my mind the LHO acted alone.....there is too much good info out there. The final straw for me was the book that was recommended right on this forum from the doctor who treated JFK at Parkland. He was right there and that is some great info to collaborate what is already out there.

[Bidmor]

JFK? Blown away?? What else do I have to say?!

You're a poet and don't know it.

[glowegal]

The ultimate book for death hags regarding the Kennedy assassination is called "JFK: Conspiracy of Silence" by Charles Crenshaw, M.D. (re-released this year as "JFK Has Been Shot"). This book was written by one of the doctors who worked on Jack at Parkland and then Lee Harvey Oswald a few days later. It's in chronological order of what the Doc witnessed along with a basic timeline for continuity.

I'm having hubby track this down as a Kindle download. I hope it includes the photos.

[Sgt. Pepper]

I'm having hubby track this down as a Kindle download. I hope it includes the photos.

http://www.amazon.com/JFK-Been-Shot-...ref=pd_sim_b_2

[SomeChick]

Hey Oregonians, Washingtonians and Northern Californians, there's a new American Experience episode on JFK tonight. Check your local listings. It's on at 8:00 pm PST here. Show description:

American Experience JFK

A new portrait of the man who often defied objective appraisal. John F. Kennedy's presidency was full of accomplishments and unfulfilled promises. Take a look back at his early political career to when he was announced as the youngest president. Part 1 of 2, continued on Tuesday, November 12th.

*NEW EPISODE*

[deleeuw]

I'm having hubby track this down as a Kindle download. I hope it includes the photos.

No photos in the Kindle version, but still a great read. Thanks for the tip off.

[Genocidal]

No photos in the Kindle version, but still a great read. Thanks for the tip off.

Got the book, the foto's aren't that shocking, although - maybe I've jus gone numb. Seen a lot more JFK autopsy foto's (and LHO's ) all over the web. I even stumbled on George de Mohrenshield's (Oswald's friend) post-suïcide foto's just by googling his name for pictures. Those haunted me for awhile.

[cash]

Dallas marks the 50th anniversary

http://www.latimes.com/travel/deals/...#axzz2kUS4EKpD

[soaring_butterfly]

The Daily Beast has been doing a series entitled 22 days of JFK. A new article every day! It's been interesting.

[tamiele]

I have watched The Kennedy Half-Century program that has been airing on TV. I found it fascinating. It focuses on the impact of JFK's presidency and how it has influenced every president since. It's worth a watch for Kennedy buffs.

[neilmpenny]

I got the latest National Geographic today (I have a subscription), and it is featuring an ad for a TV show on natgeotv called 'Killing Kennedy' starring Rob Lowe. Ridley Scott amd Bill O'Reilly are exec producers.

[Sgt. Pepper]

I got the latest National Geographic today (I have a subscription), and it is featuring an ad for a TV show on natgeotv called 'Killing Kennedy' starring Rob Lowe. Ridley Scott amd Bill O'Reilly are exec producers.

I wouldn't watch that even if you put a gun to my head. Did you know that O'Reilly's book about Lincoln's assassination was banned from the Abraham Lincoln memorial library in Springfield, IL due to having too many inaccuracies? That's hilarious!

[Hidium]

I wouldn't watch that even if you put a gun to my head. Did you know that O'Reilly's book about Lincoln's assassination was banned from the Abraham Lincoln memorial library in Springfield, IL due to having too many inaccuracies? That's hilarious!

I'm totally with you on that. He doesn't care about the facts, just his point of view.

[Hidium]

In my opinion, Jackie Kennedy was so freaked out, shocked and afraid that she might be a victim too that she was trying to get away. She probably wasn't thinking about escaping from a moving car, just a basic survival instinct told her to get away. I can only imagine how it would feel to have someone's head exploding while sitting next to them. It must have been horrifying and surreal. I think she was reacting because of fear of death, and maybe if she could process it, perhaps she was thinking about her children needing her. I think the press put out that she was trying to retrieve her husband's brain to make her seem heroic. She handled herself in a heroic way at the funeral.

[Bidmor]

Senator John F. Kennedy wrote an essay in TV Guide which turned out to be prophetic regarding television and politicians.

http://news.yahoo.com/jfk-warnings-t...115013865.html

[cash]

a nice story on Mrs. Tippit - still alive and well

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...gives-him.html

[tamiele]

I got the latest National Geographic today (I have a subscription), and it is featuring an ad for a TV show on natgeotv called 'Killing Kennedy' starring Rob Lowe. Ridley Scott amd Bill O'Reilly are exec producers.

I saw the movie and it was a complete waste of time. Nothing new, and they stuck to the lone gunman totally. It followed Oswald through his journey up to shooting the president but it just seemed so fake.

[tamiele]

I have watched so much Kennedy stuff lately that it leaves little doubt that Kennedy's death was suspicious. I have always thought that anyways but it seems most also believe that as well. Very few programs neglected to mention how the shooting of Kennedy didn't add up for one reason or another. So if EVERYONE has doubts and can poke holes in the Warren Report and there are concerns about the angle of the bullets and the inexperienced autopsy, etc., why can't they reopen it??? I realize it is 50 years later - but it is only 50 years ago. Isn't it the duty of the current President or the higher ups to want the answers once and for all? It should be officially stated that John Kennedy was killed by more than one gunman and his body should be exhumed, if there is anything left, and another autopsy performed. Even if they can't get the exact answers - at least admit they don't have the answers and state that officially - once and for all. It is such a glaring miscarriage of public trust imo.

[cleanskull]

PBS has been showing some damn good tv on JFK. All aspects. No close look at his libido but we all know he was a horndog. I'm not big on conspiracies but his death and most of the actions after are suspicious.

[Genocidal]

To everybody who has read Charles Crenshaw's book Conspiracy of Silence (1992, recently re-published as JFK has been shot); Crenshaw asks some questions in his book, things he could not know about in 1992. I can recommend Doug Horne's book "Inside the Assassination Records Review Board", which reads like an excellent follow-up and addition to dr. Crenshaw's book.

You can also watch this 18 minute documentary about Horne's book on Youtube. Warning: lots of very graphic images.

The Medical Evidence and the ARRB

Doug Horne served as the Chief Analyst for Military Records on the Assassination Records Review Board, created by the JFK Records Act in 1992. Charged with overseeing the release of records related to the assassination, the ARRB also sought to clarify conflicting evidence in the medical records. Doug Horne worked closely in this regard, and here he describes what was discovered.

[Maxster]

"Fifty years after the assassination of President John F. Kennedy, 59 percent of Americans still believe it was the work of a conspiracy. I was once among them."

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...sy.single.html

[Genocidal]

Did anybody know that in 1986 the CIA, by David Atlee Phillips personally, asked Vincent Bugliosi to continue the battle against the truth?




I try to laugh about it ...

[seurtoFW]

I guess I'm one of the few that thinks the assassination happened pretty much the way the Warren Commission found. Perhaps Oswald had input from others, but I don't think it was anyone close to the administration. I just don't believe there was the mindset at that time that the easiest way to stop unpopular legislation was to shoot the POTUS. From the documentaries I've watched lately, the Secret Service men all said the same thing about where the shots came from. The only part I have questions about is Jack Ruby and the reason he did what he did. Everyone at the Dallas PD knew him, knew he was a hot tempered egomaniac who tried to ingratiate himself into everyone's business. Maybe that's the reason? Maybe he figured he would be a hero to the nation? Maybe he was just loony as a goon? Did have reason to think Oswald would drop his name during the investigation?

[MiraculousMandarin]

The Dallas Morning News just put this display up at my local 7-11. I'm thinking about buying one. It's probably not acid-free paper though.

[choff]

The Dallas Morning News just put this display up at my local 7-11. I'm thinking about buying one. It's probably not acid-free paper though.

I have seen many copies of newspapers from the days after JFK was shot. The thing that always stood out for me was in a bunch of them the memorial ads were by various businesses and the cost was split between them even and everyone who had paid for it had their names mentioned. For example I can remember seeing a paper from Pittsburgh the day after ( I believe ) of the shooting of JFK. Big pic of the dead president and under his photo were the names of all of the then big downtown Pittsburgh department stores. In my hometown all of the downtown restaurants, everyone from the dumpy hamburger shacks to the fancy upscale dining rooms..they all got together and paid for a full page memorial for Kennedy in our local paper. I know this sort of thing also had taken place in 1968 with King and RFK. Today unfortunately if something as tragic as this would take place I have my doubts we would see say all of the local supermarkets getting together and spend money for a single full page memorial. Now they may do it on their own but they would never mention their competition even in a memorial ad.

[Bidmor]

I have seen many copies of newspapers from the days after JFK was shot. The thing that always stood out for me was in a bunch of them the memorial ads were by various businesses and the cost was split between them even and everyone who had paid for it had their names mentioned. For example I can remember seeing a paper from Pittsburgh the day after ( I believe ) of the shooting of JFK. Big pic of the dead president and under his photo were the names of all of the then big downtown Pittsburgh department stores. In my hometown all of the downtown restaurants, everyone from the dumpy hamburger shacks to the fancy upscale dining rooms..they all got together and paid for a full page memorial for Kennedy in our local paper. I know this sort of thing also had taken place in 1968 with King and RFK. Today unfortunately if something as tragic as this would take place I have my doubts we would see say all of the local supermarkets getting together and spend money for a single full page memorial. Now they may do it on their own but they would never mention their competition even in a memorial ad.

I put those ads down to aggressive sales departments of each paper. Tacky or macabre as is may be, commission ad sales people or editors or publishers (depending on the size of any given paper) would take advantage of such a tragedy for some quick and easy bucks.

Don't you think the same game goes on today with, say, cable news channels?

[cindyt]

Did anybody know that in 1986 the CIA, by David Atlee Phillips personally, asked Vincent Bugliosi to continue the battle against the truth?




I try to laugh about it ...

No, I didn't know, but why am I not surprised? I lost respect for the Bug when he wrote his JFK book and it makes me wonder about the veracity of his other books.

[cash]

audio from KRLD radio November 22/1963 - you can hear the excitement of the reporter and the cheering crowds.

http://jfk-assassination-as-it-happe...rld-radio.html

[cash]

I guess I'm one of the few that thinks the assassination happened pretty much the way the Warren Commission found. Perhaps Oswald had input from others, but I don't think it was anyone close to the administration. I just don't believe there was the mindset at that time that the easiest way to stop unpopular legislation was to shoot the POTUS. From the documentaries I've watched lately, the Secret Service men all said the same thing about where the shots came from. The only part I have questions about is Jack Ruby and the reason he did what he did. Everyone at the Dallas PD knew him, knew he was a hot tempered egomaniac who tried to ingratiate himself into everyone's business. Maybe that's the reason? Maybe he figured he would be a hero to the nation? Maybe he was just loony as a goon? Did have reason to think Oswald would drop his name during the investigation?

good article here on why the conspiracy theories don't stand up to scrutiny

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...nd_grassy.html

[Genocidal]

good article here on why the conspiracy theories don't stand up to scrutiny

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...nd_grassy.html

A reborn-Lone Nutter selling the magic bullet theory and endorsing Bugliosi. This guy is a Pullitzerprize winning expert on the CIA and the Pentagon? Way to go, journalism. I prefer Crenshaw. Take ten minutes to hear what he has to say:

[Bayou Queen]

I was visiting my niece and her husband out of town last week and we did catch the O'Reilly movie, Killing Kennedy and was wondering what was accurate and what was not. They mentioned that there was an assassination attempt on Retired U.S. Major General Edwin Walker in March of 1963, 8 months before Kennedy was assassinated, and in the movie it shows Oswald as the one who did it. I had NEVER heard this story so my niece looked it up and sure enough, this is supposed to be true. But my question is, Walker was sitting stationary and Oswald shot him through a window and missed, Walker was wounded by schwrap (sp) metal, yet Oswald hit a moving target (Kennedy) from a fifth floor window and fatally wounded Kennedy? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Harvey_Oswald

[Maxster]

I was visiting my niece and her husband out of town last week and we did catch the O'Reilly movie, Killing Kennedy and was wondering what was accurate and what was not. They mentioned that there was an assassination attempt on Retired U.S. Major General Edwin Walker in March of 1963, 8 months before Kennedy was assassinated, and in the movie it shows Oswald as the one who did it. I had NEVER heard this story so my niece looked it up and sure enough, this is supposed to be true. But my question is, Walker was sitting stationary and Oswald shot him through a window and missed, Walker was wounded by schwrap (sp) metal, yet Oswald hit a moving target (Kennedy) from a fifth floor window and fatally wounded Kennedy? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Harvey_Oswald

The bullet hit the wooden window frame and deflected and Oswald did not have time for a second shot.

[cash]

a piece on Marguerite Oswald - a terrible woman probably a sociopath. I agree with Norman Mailer who surmised that Lee Oswald wasn't shooting JFK on November 22/1962, he was shooting his deranged mother.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...e-of-work.html

[tamiele]

This made me smile. To know they had a romp at least before they got to their destination. I love these two, despite his cheating ways, and I like to believe they had their moments that they truly loved each other. From what I heard, after the death of baby Patrick, he seemed to value her in his life so much more. I wonder if this was one of their first "encounters" after the baby because she had had the baby in August plus took that personal time on Onassis' boat.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/wor...-1226762143458

JACKIE Kennedy had sex with John F. Kennedy on Air Force One the day before he was assassinated - a "last hour of serenity", according to historian William Manchester. But Manchester camouflaged the encounter in his 1967 book, The Death of a President, out of discretion, he admitted to me in the mid-1970s.
At the time, I was researching a book on JFK’s Don Juanism for Delacorte Press. We shared a literary agent, Don Congdon, who arranged a rendezvous at Wesleyan University, where Manchester was writer-in-residence.

More at the link.

[cindyt]

http://www.ajc.com/news/national/jfk...tlink_homepage

[Alanwench]

I have watched so much Kennedy stuff lately that it leaves little doubt that Kennedy's death was suspicious. I have always thought that anyways but it seems most also believe that as well. Very few programs neglected to mention how the shooting of Kennedy didn't add up for one reason or another. So if EVERYONE has doubts and can poke holes in the Warren Report and there are concerns about the angle of the bullets and the inexperienced autopsy, etc., why can't they reopen it??? I realize it is 50 years later - but it is only 50 years ago. Isn't it the duty of the current President or the higher ups to want the answers once and for all? It should be officially stated that John Kennedy was killed by more than one gunman and his body should be exhumed, if there is anything left, and another autopsy performed. Even if they can't get the exact answers - at least admit they don't have the answers and state that officially - once and for all. It is such a glaring miscarriage of public trust imo.

ITA, Tamiele. Sad thing is, we will never get to know what really happened. Just one question, had JFK not been murdered, would the Addison' s disease eventually killed him? If any fellow Hag has extreme medical knowledge, please let me know.

[Maxster]

AFAIK only one President's body has been exhumed and autopsied. For all the expense, all that was verified was the original cause of death and the conspiracy theory exposed as bunk.

No President is going to order JFK's body exhumed on the basis of crackpot conspiracy theories.

[tamiele]

In recent days I have learned that in the interview that Jackie gave to Arthur Schlessinger 4 months after the assassination, she gave some interesting details I hadn't thought of. Regarding the Addison's Disease - JFK had been receiving pain killers as well as a large concoction of all sorts of things. It made him not just feel no pain but euphoric as well. Bobby was concerned about this Dr. death Jack was seeing and had researched the different drugs the Dr. was giving to Jack. When JFK was shot, and the first autopsy was so poorly done, Bobby accepted that report in order to prevent the knowledge of the drugs in JFK's system to become public knowledge.

Another program I watched was called The Lost Bullet. It had plausible explanations for the 3 bullets, including the angle. Basically the bullet A was a miss and was shot about 5 seconds before the 2nd bullet. The 2nd and 3rd bullet (the head shot) were within about 6 seconds of each other so the entire 3 bullets may have been 11 seconds in duration - certainly doable for a guy like Oswald. I don't know if I believe the head wound explanation but they had lots of reasons to support their theory.

[Bayou Queen]

Thank you Tamie for the info you are providing. I think I mentioned that JFK was killed on my 11th birthday. (on a Friday, and isn't it a co-inky-dink that the 50th year anniversary of his death is also on a Friday). I have SO many books on Kennedy packed away that I have bought over the years, I will have to someday dig them out and read them now that I am retired. I just remember that it was crazy down here when I was a teenager with all the accusations of a conspiracy from Jim Garrison who was the District Attorney in New Orleans at the time, and all the so called "connections" with Oswald and some local colorful people including Mafia boss Carlos Marcello. No doubt, this entire investigation was mishandled, from the blood work to "where's the brain". Thank you Hags for posting things I had forgotten, and some new theories also. Too much mishandled information has caused many of us to wonder what the real truth is. I didn't know Oswald was born here, I wonder what neighborhood he grew up in?

[Genocidal]

A very informative article about JFK 's presidency and what he was up against. It's called JFK vs. the Military.



http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/...litary/309496/

[kmgt]

How long did Mrs. Kennedy and the kids stay in the White House? and where did they go after they moved out? Did they stay as close to the Kennedy family as they would have been had JFK not died?

[tamiele]

How long did Mrs. Kennedy and the kids stay in the White House? and where did they go after they moved out? Did they stay as close to the Kennedy family as they would have been had JFK not died?

According to the Schlessinger interview she gave after JFK's death - she moved out of the white house on December 3rd - 11 days after the assassination. She moved into a townhouse style place I think it was in Washington but found she had no privacy so eventually moved to New York. I don't know about how close she stayed with the Kennedy family.

[1karenhb]

I guess I'm one of the few that thinks the assassination happened pretty much the way the Warren Commission found. Perhaps Oswald had input from others, but I don't think it was anyone close to the administration. I just don't believe there was the mindset at that time that the easiest way to stop unpopular legislation was to shoot the POTUS. From the documentaries I've watched lately, the Secret Service men all said the same thing about where the shots came from. The only part I have questions about is Jack Ruby and the reason he did what he did. Everyone at the Dallas PD knew him, knew he was a hot tempered egomaniac who tried to ingratiate himself into everyone's business. Maybe that's the reason? Maybe he figured he would be a hero to the nation? Maybe he was just loony as a goon? Did have reason to think Oswald would drop his name during the investigation?

seurtoFW I agree with you and I've always wondered why Ruby did it too. Saw a show last week about the shooting using modern forensics. They came to the conclusion that Oswald was the lone shooter. First shot missed. Second shot hit Kennedy in the neck and then hit Connely (sp) and third shot hit his head. I was 10 in 1963 and in school when it was announced what had happened. I happened to be watching the tv when Oswald was shot. My parents were in another room when it happened and I remember yelling they just shot a guy on live tv.

[71sportstourer]

Anyone get burned out by the JFK specials in upcoming days but still what to stay within the subjects of 1960s mysteries, murder, and politics, there's a new book out about the murder of IL Senator Chuck Percy's daughter, unsolved, 1966 called Sympathy Vote: a Reinvestigation of the Valerie Percy Murder. It appears only to be Kindle and Nook but I hear a print version will be out soon.

[Linnie]

This was perhaps the very first book to dissect the official story and early conspiracy theories (1964). It was a favorite of mine when I was a youngling.
It even delves into the Oswald-Ruby relationship, Officer Tippitt, and what all the previous Presidential assassinations had in common.
If you can snag a copy (alas, I lent mine to someone who lent it to someone who never returned it), it's still a worthwhile read, IMO:

http://www.amazon.com/Who-killed-Ken.../dp/B00005X6M4

[cindyt]

Pretty sure I read that long time ago.

[Tiffany]

hey why was he called 'Camelot' ? Esp. when he was having affairs